Agenda item

Jason Ablewhite, Cambridgeshire Police and Crime Commissioner, will be in attendance to discuss the Fire Governance Consultation.

The Police and Crime Commissioner (PCC), Jason Ablewhite, was in attendance to addressed the Panel and inform them of his Fire Governance Consultation. Members were informed that the Government have amended legislation to allow Police and Crime Commissioners to take on the governance of the Fire Service. The legislation provides four options relating to fire governance: the no change option, the representation option, the governance option and the single employer option.

The PCC stated that he has been working closely with the Fire Authority on governance and they have been fully involved with the process. The Panel was informed that the PCC and three members of the Fire Authority decided to hire PA Consulting in order to put together a Business Case. The consultant recommended option three, the governance option.

An eight week consultation is now in progress and in the opinion of the Police and Crime Commissioner there are significant benefits of fire governance coming under the remit of the PCC.

The PCC highlighted the potential savings from the better use of the fire and police estates by explaining to Members the current collaboration over the location of the Fire Service Headquarters and the relocation of the Fire Service’s training facility to the Police training centre at Monks Wood.

The PCC expects that there will be opposition from Cambridgeshire County Council, however he believes that change is required. Every other PCC with the exception of Bedfordshire is pursing the governance option.

In response to the question, what risks that had been identified, the Panel was informed that the biggest risk was lack of staff buy in. There is an option to have one Chief Officer across both services however the PCC believes that the option is not practical and that the staff wouldn’t buy into it.

Concern was raised that the Parish Councils are not receiving the information on the Fire Governance consultation, however the PCC stated the Parish Councils are receiving the information however the consultation has only just begun.

Following a question, Members were informed that if the Fire Authority was abolished it would save £108k per annum. The PCC recognised that his office does cost more than the previous Police Authority however he has more responsibility. In response to the question, would he take on a deputy for the governance of the Fire Service, the Panel was informed that he wouldn’t but he would appoint an assistant commissioner on a part time basis.

In response to the criticism from the Fire Authority, the PCC stated that it is not surprising they are criticising the plans as they are not keen to give up their allowances and responsibilities.

Following concerns that the governance will be in the hands of one individual and that the PCC wasn’t elected at the Police, Fire and Crime Commissioner, the Panel was informed that the current PCC stood on the platform of taking on the governance of the fire service and that the next PCC election will be in 2020. The PCC believes that fire governance can easily be incorporated into the police governance structure.

County Councillor and Chairman of the Fire Authority Kevin Reynolds addressed the Panel. Members were informed that the Fire Authority has published a response to the PCC’s Fire Governance Consultation on 13th July 2017 and has based the response on evidence.

The Fire Authority Chairman stated that the business case lacks evidence and that the Fire Authority recommends option two, the representation option. Members were informed that the Fire Authority believes that the savings stated in the business case have been overstated with only £14k being realistic.

The Panel was informed that Gloucestershire and Hertfordshire Fire Authorities have made similar responses to Cambridgeshire however Essex and Northamptonshire Fire Authorities have decided that the governance route is the best option.

In response to a question, the Fire Authority Chairman stated that the objection to the governance option is not forever and if there was an option to restructure local government then the Fire Authority would recommend the governance option. In the Fire Authority Chairman’s opinion, the fire service has the trust of the public and governance from the PCC may jeopardise that trust.

The Panel

RESOLVED

1)  to refer the item to Cabinet as a matter of urgency and decide whether a response on behalf of the Council is appropriate;

2)  to recommend the Cabinet reviews all the documents and perhaps invite both the Police and Crime Commissioner and the Chairman of the Fire Authority to attend the Cabinet when the item is discussed before formulating a response, and

3)  to recommend that whilst the Cabinet is to formulate a Council response, individual Members should be allowed to formulate their own responses to the consultation.

(At 8.25pm, during the consideration of this item, Councillor Mrs P A Jordan left the meeting and did not return.)